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Post by Weasel Pie on May 24, 2016 18:28:01 GMT
I gotta laugh now because I see a lot of people talking about Bran the time traveler now. Heh.
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Post by Some Pig No Doubt on May 24, 2016 19:27:04 GMT
Not only are they talking about it, they're bitching about it! "OMG, I'm going to be so disappointed if GRRM includes time travel in the books, it's so cheap and science fictiony and GRRM is such a better writer than that." do ya know ANYTHING about the author? anything at all???
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Post by Melifeather on May 24, 2016 21:01:49 GMT
I think they say things like that rather than be embarrassed if they've been spouting off about a wrong interpretation...nobody likes to be wrong, but Michael Jordan says failing over and over was the key to his success!
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Post by Melifeather on May 25, 2016 11:40:16 GMT
Thinking about this Back to the Future style tinkering with the past, I think there's evidence Bloodraven employed it. Consider this wiki condensed version of events regarding Lord Butterwell's tourney:
Lord Ambrose hosted the Whitewalls tourney to celebrate his marriage to a daughter of House Frey, but the tourney was also secretly an attempt to foment the Second Blackfyre Rebellion in the name of Daemon II Blackfyre. The winner would receive the dragon egg that had been given to Butterwell's grandfather by King Aegon IV Targaryen. However, the egg was stolen before it could be awarded. After the squire Egg (Prince Aegon Targaryen in disguise) attempted to send a message to his father, Prince Maekar Targaryen and tried to use his father's ring to persuade the maester, he was presented to Lord Ambrose. Aegon bluffed him by claiming that he was a spy and that an army was coming, after which Ambrose recanted his allegiance to House Blackfyre and fled with Lord Frey. However, before he could get far, Lord Brynden Rivers appeared with an army and put an end to the nascent rebellion. Lord Ambrose lost his castle Whitewalls (which was razed and the earth salted), and was only allowed to keep a tenth of his house's fortunes along with his head.
How did Lord Brynden arrive right at the most opportune time?
I'm thinking Bloodraven brought Bran back to Winterfell so he could witness himself Hodoring Walder. This would also explain how Bloodraven could say that he'd been watching for a thousand years. He could watch a thousand years worth of history through the weirwoods, tweaking the past here and there. I know he said something about not changing history, that the ink was dry or something to that effect, but maybe Bloodraven was satisfied with what he had done so far?
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Post by Weasel Pie on May 25, 2016 12:03:14 GMT
I don't think Bran is going back ... again ... to change things. I think he's already done that, hard to explain. And right now I just wanna roll my eyes because GRRM decided to use the names Brynden and Brandon. Why George Why?
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Post by Weasel Pie on May 25, 2016 12:16:18 GMT
Brynden to Brandon "The time has come for you to become me"
Bran means Raven. Brandon means Sword. Sigh. Did GRRM really do that?
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Post by Some Pig No Doubt on May 25, 2016 13:33:05 GMT
Brynden to Brandon "The time has come for you to become me"
Bran means Raven. Brandon means Sword. Sigh. Did GRRM really do that? And recall GRRM's admission of poring through baby name books with great deliberation to choose exactly. the. right. ones.
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Post by Melifeather on May 25, 2016 23:10:53 GMT
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Post by Melifeather on May 26, 2016 12:11:18 GMT
Bran the Timelord as Bran the Builder makes sense if we view Bran as "building" history through time. I like that. I like it a lot.
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Post by Weasel Pie on May 26, 2016 12:57:56 GMT
I agree with a lot of this, but I have an initial question, how could Meera be Jon's mother? She's not old enough. Isn't she Jon's age? Necromancing this question.
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Post by freyfamilyreunion on May 26, 2016 19:57:55 GMT
Just to intersect this theory with my own theory about the White Walkers. I firmly believe that based on Martin's description of the death of the White Walkers, and how their frozen swords interact with steel, that the White Walkers are frozen air. Outer shell of frozen nitrogen and "blood" made up of pale blue liquid oxygen. Perhaps their swords are frozen co2, dry ice, which makes a high pitch squeal when it comes into contact with metal. Now couple this with the fact that it seems that Bran can interact with the past by creating wind: Osha tells Bran that the Old Gods communicate through the wind: The times Bran is able to interact with the past it appears to be his voice made audible through the whispering of the wind: And another rustle of the leaves if this was indeed Bran speaking to Theon through the weirwoods:
So if Bran can reach back in time and manipulate the wind, and if in fact the White Walkers are actually frozen air golems made to resemble the White Walkers of legend, then I think it's at least possible that future Bran may have been the one who reached back into time and helped create the White Walkers that we've seen in the books.
I would also note, how suspiciously like knights, the White Walkers are. They are armored and carry longswords. And we know how much Bran loves his dreams of knights and the kingsguards.
ETA: Now compare the above to the time the White Walkers make their first appearance in the books:
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Post by winterbowl on Jun 13, 2016 7:19:22 GMT
Just to intersect this theory with my own theory about the White Walkers. I firmly believe that based on Martin's description of the death of the White Walkers, and how their frozen swords interact with steel, that the White Walkers are frozen air. Outer shell of frozen nitrogen and "blood" made up of pale blue liquid oxygen. Perhaps their swords are frozen co2, dry ice, which makes a high pitch squeal when it comes into contact with metal. Now couple this with the fact that it seems that Bran can interact with the past by creating wind: Osha tells Bran that the Old Gods communicate through the wind: The times Bran is able to interact with the past it appears to be his voice made audible through the whispering of the wind: And another rustle of the leaves if this was indeed Bran speaking to Theon through the weirwoods:
So if Bran can reach back in time and manipulate the wind, and if in fact the White Walkers are actually frozen air golems made to resemble the White Walkers of legend, then I think it's at least possible that future Bran may have been the one who reached back into time and helped create the White Walkers that we've seen in the books.
I would also note, how suspiciously like knights, the White Walkers are. They are armored and carry longswords. And we know how much Bran loves his dreams of knights and the kingsguards.
ETA: Now compare the above to the time the White Walkers make their first appearance in the books:
Damn, I really didn't like this Time Travel stuff being introduced at all, but going somewhere like that with it could redeem it. Did you ever post a thread outlining your fake Other theory on Westeros.org?
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Post by freyfamilyreunion on Jun 13, 2016 11:22:23 GMT
Just to intersect this theory with my own theory about the White Walkers. I firmly believe that based on Martin's description of the death of the White Walkers, and how their frozen swords interact with steel, that the White Walkers are frozen air. Outer shell of frozen nitrogen and "blood" made up of pale blue liquid oxygen. Perhaps their swords are frozen co2, dry ice, which makes a high pitch squeal when it comes into contact with metal. Now couple this with the fact that it seems that Bran can interact with the past by creating wind: Osha tells Bran that the Old Gods communicate through the wind: The times Bran is able to interact with the past it appears to be his voice made audible through the whispering of the wind: And another rustle of the leaves if this was indeed Bran speaking to Theon through the weirwoods:
So if Bran can reach back in time and manipulate the wind, and if in fact the White Walkers are actually frozen air golems made to resemble the White Walkers of legend, then I think it's at least possible that future Bran may have been the one who reached back into time and helped create the White Walkers that we've seen in the books.
I would also note, how suspiciously like knights, the White Walkers are. They are armored and carry longswords. And we know how much Bran loves his dreams of knights and the kingsguards.
ETA: Now compare the above to the time the White Walkers make their first appearance in the books:
Damn, I really didn't like this Time Travel stuff being introduced at all, but going somewhere like that with it could redeem it. Did you ever post a thread outlining your fake Other theory on Westeros.org? I've discussed the White Walkers being made of frozen air quite a bit in the Heresy thread. In fact, I'm pretty sure that I got the idea from a previous discussion in Heresy, but I couldn't tell you which posters were the first to discuss it. And I think one time, also in Heresy, I tied it into Bran going back in time through the Weirwoods to help create the White Walkers. There has been a pretty interesting thread (I'm not sure if it was on here or a previous board) that discussed the similarities between Melisandre's shadow babies and the White Walkers, and Black Crow on Heresy has long championed the idea that Craster's children were turned into White Walkers, and the COTF as being responsible. I'm trying to put together a thread that combines all of the above. My main thought is these White Walkers have been created by someone or multiple someones to create a bogey man to scare the Wildlling south of the Wall. My thought is that it takes both Aeromancers and Shadow binders along with human sacrifice (much like it took human sacrifice to hatch Dany's Dragons).
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Post by Melifeather on Jun 13, 2016 11:34:38 GMT
There is a white walker/Others thread here: LINKMaybe you can revive the discussion?
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Post by min on Jul 22, 2016 23:28:05 GMT
In time, Bran will be able to see beyond the trees. And that past, present, and future are one. Nor will your sight be limited to your godswood. This right here: A weirwood.It seemed to sprout from solid rock, its pale roots twisting up from a myriad of fissures and hairline cracks. The tree was slender compared to other weirwoods he had seen, no more than a sapling, yet it was growing as he watched, its limbs thickening as they reached for the sky. Wary, he circled the smooth white trunk until he came to the face. Red eyes looked at him. Fierce eyes they were, yet glad to see him. The weirwood had his brother's face. Had is brother always had three eyes?
Not always came the silent shout. Not before the crow.
....
Don't be afraid, I like it in the dark. No one can see you, but you can see them. But first you have to open your eyes. See? Like this. And the tree reached down and touched him. This is Bran unconfined by time and space. The wierwood sprouting and growing before Jon's eyes representing time. Jon encounters him in the wolfdream at the Skirling Pass in aCoK. This is before Sam brings Bran and party through the Black Gate. This is future Bran talking to Jon in the past. Timeline check?
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