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Post by darksister1001 on Apr 12, 2016 19:03:58 GMT
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Post by Maester Flagons on Apr 13, 2016 0:24:28 GMT
I think that your on to something here. The Shiera/Mel mother/daughter doesn't really work since Mel should be older than Shiera and Bloodraven. Quaithe and Melisandre... that seems more likely and more in line with the current events. One hides behind a glamour and one hides behind a mask. I like it!
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Post by Ser Duncan on Apr 13, 2016 18:01:48 GMT
I reject the mother/daughter relationship as I see no reason that that must be the connection. I purpose my own conclusion. These shadowbinders from Asshai are sisters, maybe even be twins. Well, I'm not sure about the twins part, but I'm on board with them being sisters. The part that always stops me believing that Mel is Shiera's daughter is the slavery bit in Mel's memory. I just can't see Shiera falling to capture and becoming a slave. It's clear from Mel's memory that her mother must've been a slave too, since there isn't any other way she'd be present to the sale. True, she maybe in the crowd, like what happens with Tyrion, but how could she have lost a young daughter and Shieara escape the slavers. Just too complicated for my taste. Now since we know Mel was sold in a lot, meaning there was more than just her being sold, then it's entirely possible she has a sister sold in that same lot. So one becomes a Red Priestess, and the other becomes a reknowned shadowbinder. They are both from Asshai, so it's not impossible that after the lot was bought, it was broken up and the people resold to others. They are both shadowbinders as well. Also of note is that Quaithe's mask is red lacquered. Of all the colours in the world a shadowbinder might use, why choose red? I'm thinking Mel did not get sold to the Red Temple, she and Quaithe might have been taught how to shadowbind and then went their separate ways when they came to adolescence. If Mel was placed in the temple out of devotion, rather than sold, it would mean that Quaithe was likewise free to choose her calling. Do we have any evidence that Mel was a sold to the Red Priests, like Thoros was? I don't think so. We only know she was sold, but not to whom. I'm working on another idea about all the connections to shadowbinding in the books because there seems to be a pattern going on, but I've not quite cracked it yet. |
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Post by darksister1001 on Apr 15, 2016 19:13:29 GMT
I think that your on to something here. The Shiera/Mel mother/daughter doesn't really work since Mel should be older than Shiera and Bloodraven. Quaithe and Melisandre... that seems more likely and more in line with the current events. One hides behind a glamour and one hides behind a mask. I like it! Thanks! I see the connections to each of them but I don't see anything that signifies mother/daughter. That relationship connection is, IMO, baseless. Plus this theory allows me to keep on believing that Old Nan is Shiera. 
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Post by darksister1001 on Apr 15, 2016 19:22:53 GMT
I reject the mother/daughter relationship as I see no reason that that must be the connection. I purpose my own conclusion. These shadowbinders from Asshai are sisters, maybe even be twins. Well, I'm not sure about the twins part, but I'm on board with them being sisters. The part that always stops me believing that Mel is Shiera's daughter is the slavery bit in Mel's memory. I just can't see Shiera falling to capture and becoming a slave. It's clear from Mel's memory that her mother must've been a slave too, since there isn't any other way she'd be present to the sale. True, she maybe in the crowd, like what happens with Tyrion, but how could she have lost a young daughter and Shieara escape the slavers. Just too complicated for my taste. Now since we know Mel was sold in a lot, meaning there was more than just her being sold, then it's entirely possible she has a sister sold in that same lot. So one becomes a Red Priestess, and the other becomes a reknowned shadowbinder. They are both from Asshai, so it's not impossible that after the lot was bought, it was broken up and the people resold to others. They are both shadowbinders as well. Also of note is that Quaithe's mask is red lacquered. Of all the colours in the world a shadowbinder might use, why choose red? I'm thinking Mel did not get sold to the Red Temple, she and Quaithe might have been taught how to shadowbind and then went their separate ways when they came to adolescence. If Mel was placed in the temple out of devotion, rather than sold, it would mean that Quaithe was likewise free to choose her calling. Do we have any evidence that Mel was a sold to the Red Priests, like Thoros was? I don't think so. We only know she was sold, but not to whom. I'm working on another idea about all the connections to shadowbinding in the books because there seems to be a pattern going on, but I've not quite cracked it yet. Thanks! Truthfully, I'm not sold on the twin part either. I threw that in for flair.
Serenei died birthing Shiera but she could still have had family in Lys. Pure conjecture here, but I was thinking that maybe Shiera left them in the care of someone else and something happened. Lys has ties to the salving world so if their caretaker fell ill or something it's possible that the girls were sold into slavery.
I look forward to reading it!
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Post by Ser Duncan on Apr 15, 2016 20:29:59 GMT
Serenei died birthing Shiera but she could still have had family in Lys. Pure conjecture here, but I was thinking that maybe Shiera left them in the care of someone else and something happened. Lys has ties to the salving world so if their caretaker fell ill or something it's possible that the girls were sold into slavery. I hadn't considered this possibility. It is entirely possible that the woman who calls out 'Melony' is not her mother. It could be a caretaker or even an aunt. All we know is, it was a woman's voice. Or perhaps it's Quaithe's voice. It's been know to happen that sibling can be as far as a generation apart. If Quaithe was born some 20 years before Mel, it would account for her having a woman's voice. Hell in Planetos a woman is girl that's flowered, so that again difference could even be reduced. As to the shadowbinding thread, that may take a while. I've got finals coming up, and projects (group and individual) due soon, so it'll have to wait a bit. |
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Post by darksister1001 on Apr 15, 2016 23:31:20 GMT
I hadn't considered this possibility. It is entirely possible that the woman who calls out 'Melony' is not her mother. It could be a caretaker or even an aunt. All we know is, it was a woman's voice. Or perhaps it's Quaithe's voice. It's been know to happen that sibling can be as far as a generation apart. If Quaithe was born some 20 years before Mel, it would account for her having a woman's voice. Hell in Planetos a woman is girl that's flowered, so that again difference could even be reduced. As to the shadowbinding thread, that may take a while. I've got finals coming up, and projects (group and individual) due soon, so it'll have to wait a bit. I think we'll get a little more info in the "She-Wolves" (or whatever he decides to call it) next D&E.
Sweet Ser Willem dies and the house-staff threw out Dany & Viserys. They were lucky that was in a free city. They could have had very different lives if that had lived in a slave city. Especially one like Lys where they love pretty boys and girls. Especially ones with Valyrian looks; which I expect Sheira's & BRs offspring to have.
Most of the people are considered "grown" around the age of 15. Doran & Oberyn are 10 years apart. Robb & Rickon are 11 years apart. However, I don't think that's the case with Mel & Quaithe. They would need to be close in age if BR & Sheira are their parents, IMO.
I'm leaning more towards a caretaker being the voice. Again going back to Dany & Vis. And again, no textual evidence. Just hunches and assumptions (the mother of all eff ups, according to my hubs, lol). If one was older, even grown then I would think they would take care of the younger one.
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