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Post by jnr on Jul 14, 2016 20:01:28 GMT
Not to mention the Westeros Podcast confirming that that horse left the barn long ago. Is this by Ran and Linda, or do you mean the podcast done by two RLJers (Yolkboy and Lady Gwen)? See, I've been curious for months if GRRM might have spilled something in 2015 to Ran, because of Ran's remarks late last year that for a long time, he's been strongly arguing for things he knew to be false. Quite a curious position for him to take. I've also been wondering exactly what the show script instructed the Lyanna actress to do, in her Promise Me Ned scene. My guess is that it looked like this: This would achieve the intended effect and would not reveal a great secret either to the actress or anyone else with a copy of the script. It would also mean that any attempts to listen with the volume cranked are totally futile. Furthermore, in that scenario, the teen actress could whisper more or less whatever she wanted, knowing it would be dialed down in postproduction to the point of uselessness. So here are some possibilities that might have occurred to her:
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Post by min on Jul 14, 2016 21:19:01 GMT
That would be Linda's podcast on the finale. Arguing for things he knows to be false. That is curious and I suppose if GRRM spilled to anyone; it seems probable that Ran knows something, about something. I have never heard of Yolkboy and Lady Gwen and I never bothered with the RLJ thread.
Isn't the prevailing theory, that prophecy is a treacherous woman who would bite off your dick and hit you over the head with it?
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Post by wolfmaid7 on Jul 15, 2016 0:03:55 GMT
I have tried over and over to provide the alternate context that GRRM has written regarding the parallel inversions, but all I get are crickets...I'm pretty much ignored. Oh well. They cannot say that no one saw it coming that Rhaegar was setup as a patsy. I may not buy into the inversion theory atleast in the way i think you mean.But that Rhaegar was patsy your preaching to the choir on that one.I've been saying this for a while now.Rhaegar was more or less clueless.That he was set up to me is almost 100% in my mind a given. s this by Ran and Linda, or do you mean the podcast done by two RLJers (Yolkboy and Lady Gwen)? See, I've been curious for months if GRRM might have spilled something in 2015 to Ran, because of Ran's remarks late last year that for a long time, he's been strongly arguing for things he knew to be false. Quite a curious position for him to take. I've also been wondering exactly what the show script instructed the Lyanna actress to do, in her Promise Me Ned scene. My guess is that it looked like this: Did you see her review for the finale?
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Post by jnr on Jul 15, 2016 2:41:00 GMT
Isn't the prevailing theory, that prophecy is a treacherous woman who would bite off your dick and hit you over the head with it? I would call that 100% likely, unwritten canon. Did you see her review for the finale? No, I haven't been able to take either her or Ran very seriously as analysts ever since they both kept insisting that in the books, Stannis must burn Shireen. Kinda typical of the way they think; I bet they also believe Hodor dies the way he did on the show, and for the same reason. Is the review unintentionally funny, maybe?
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 8:54:07 GMT
Is the review unintentionally funny, maybe? She hated it. Panned everything except RLJ and was somewhat annoyed because that was so obvious anyway. There is this tendency to hang onto every word that they say and since they sit at the right of GRRM, it must be canon... or they must know something. It's the fallacy of appeal to authority. I wonder if Ran's curious statement has something to do with the WoIaF. Wasn't it revealed that some things in the book were deliberately wrong or misleading? I haven't a clue on what that might be. I don't really follow the podcasts. I find them a bit dry and I'm not learning anything.
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 12:35:54 GMT
I was just reading a bit of the Heresy thread and the idea that the pact is related to marriage between bloodlines of ice and fire. It's an interesting idea. Black Crow asserts that the father doesn't matter. It's the mother that carries the royal jelly and this makes Jon a true son of Winterfell. Why is the father discounted when so much effort went into GoT identifying the genetics traits of the father? Certainly with Robert's bastards and then when Cersei flings the same accusation at Ned about Jon. That blood will out and she has seen his son.
If the SSM about the Sword of the Morning returning is true; then why isn't Ashara Dayne's blood just as important as Lyanna's? Jon may not have Ned's name but he would still have his blood.
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Post by Melifeather on Jul 15, 2016 15:01:04 GMT
I was just reading a bit of the Heresy thread and the idea that the pact is related to marriage between bloodlines of ice and fire. It's an interesting idea. Black Crow asserts that the father doesn't matter. It's the mother that carries the royal jelly and this makes Jon a true son of Winterfell. Why is the father discounted when so much effort went into GoT identifying the genetics traits of the father? Certainly with Robert's bastards and then when Cersei flings the same accusation at Ned about Jon. That blood will out and she has seen his son. If the SSM about the Sword of the Morning returning is true; then why isn't Ashara Dayne's blood just as important as Lyanna's? Jon may not have Ned's name but he would still have his blood. Yes, I agree that many of the pacts on the wheel of time were marriages. I think BC keeps stressing Lyanna as Jon's mother, because it's his way of sidesteping the R+L=J argument without encouraging yet another debate on his parentage. I for one think the Daynes are every bit as important as the Starks and Ashara is another magic maid, but where Lyanna is a moonmaid, Ashara should be a sunmaid or dawnmaid, lol, whatever would be the opposite. Although arguably the sacrifice of the moonmaid is the recurring event on the wheel as it symbolically represents when the moon (Nissa Nissa) was shattered by the comet.
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Post by Ser Duncan on Jul 15, 2016 15:08:55 GMT
they both kept insisting that in the books, Stannis must burn Shireen. Sorry, what? Stannis is going to burn Shireen? Stannis? How on earth does that make any sense, particularly after his instructions to Massey? It's the fallacy of appeal to authority. That's the reason I was thinking about in my rant upthread of people just not thinking for themselves. Why is the father discounted when so much effort went into GoT identifying the genetics traits of the father? Certainly with Robert's bastards and then when Cersei flings the same accusation at Ned about Jon. That blood will out and she has seen his son. Tyrion, Cat, Stannis, Arya, Sansa and Ned himself all say Jon looks like Ned, either directly or by indirect comparison to the Stark look that Ned has.
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 15:12:42 GMT
I was just reading a bit of the Heresy thread and the idea that the pact is related to marriage between bloodlines of ice and fire. It's an interesting idea. Black Crow asserts that the father doesn't matter. It's the mother that carries the royal jelly and this makes Jon a true son of Winterfell. Why is the father discounted when so much effort went into GoT identifying the genetics traits of the father? Certainly with Robert's bastards and then when Cersei flings the same accusation at Ned about Jon. That blood will out and she has seen his son. If the SSM about the Sword of the Morning returning is true; then why isn't Ashara Dayne's blood just as important as Lyanna's? Jon may not have Ned's name but he would still have his blood. Yes, I agree that many of the pacts on the wheel of time were marriages. I think BC keeps stressing Lyanna as Jon's mother, because it's his way of sidesteping the R+L=J argument without encouraging yet another debate on his parentage. I for one think the Daynes are every bit as important as the Starks and Ashara is another magic maid, but where Lyanna is a moonmaid, Ashara should be a sunmaid or dawnmaid, lol, whatever would be the opposite. Although arguably the sacrifice of the moonmaid is the recurring event on the wheel as it symbolically represents when the moon (Nissa Nissa) was shattered by the comet. Maybe it's another kind of inversion? In the north instead of the female line, it's the male line and vice versa in the south? Who is going to take on Euron and his valyrion armour if it isn't the sword of the morning with the palestone sword?
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 15:20:58 GMT
It's the fallacy of appeal to authority. That's the reason I was thinking about in my rant upthread of people just not thinking for themselves.
Why is the father discounted when so much effort went into GoT identifying the genetics traits of the father? Certainly with Robert's bastards and then when Cersei flings the same accusation at Ned about Jon. That blood will out and she has seen his son. Tyrion, Cat, Stannis, Arya, Sansa and Ned himself all say Jon looks like Ned, either directly or by indirect comparison to the Stark look that Ned has. Group pressure to conform is very powerful. Otherwise, ostracism might follow. I am not really stuck on my own ideas; I can be persuaded otherwise pretty easily with a better argument or mystery. The one thing I can't seem to let go is Jon's parentage. I'm still with Ned as Jon's sire and not just because everyone dismisses it.
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Post by Melifeather on Jul 15, 2016 15:23:41 GMT
Yes, I agree that many of the pacts on the wheel of time were marriages. I think BC keeps stressing Lyanna as Jon's mother, because it's his way of sidesteping the R+L=J argument without encouraging yet another debate on his parentage. I for one think the Daynes are every bit as important as the Starks and Ashara is another magic maid, but where Lyanna is a moonmaid, Ashara should be a sunmaid or dawnmaid, lol, whatever would be the opposite. Although arguably the sacrifice of the moonmaid is the recurring event on the wheel as it symbolically represents when the moon (Nissa Nissa) was shattered by the comet. Maybe it's another kind of inversion? In the north instead of the female line, it's the male line and vice versa in the south? Who is going to take on Euron and his valyrion armour if it isn't the sword of the morning with the palestone sword? Some Pig had an idea that since Aegon the Conqueror burned ironborn Harren in his castle that Euron will bring the dragons to Harrenhal first with some type of showdown, then when he makes the move to go north the King in the North will not kneel this time. IMO Jon will be wielding a fiery black sword.
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 15:25:00 GMT
Maybe it's another kind of inversion? In the north instead of the female line, it's the male line and vice versa in the south? Who is going to take on Euron and his valyrion armour if it isn't the sword of the morning with the palestone sword? Some Pig had an idea that since Aegon the Conqueror burned ironborn Harren in his castle that Euron will bring the dragons to Harrenhal first with some type of showdown, then when he makes the move to go north the King in the North will not kneel this time. IMO Jon will be wielding a fiery black sword. Or he could end up with two swords.
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Post by Melifeather on Jul 15, 2016 15:25:11 GMT
That's the reason I was thinking about in my rant upthread of people just not thinking for themselves.
Tyrion, Cat, Stannis, Arya, Sansa and Ned himself all say Jon looks like Ned, either directly or by indirect comparison to the Stark look that Ned has. Group pressure to conform is very powerful. Otherwise, ostracism might follow. I am not really stuck on my own ideas; I can be persuaded otherwise pretty easily with a better argument or mystery. The one thing I can't seem to let go is Jon's parentage. I'm still with Ned as Jon's sire and not just because everyone dismisses it. I'm hoping for this as well, that Ned was Jon's father after all and Wylla his mother, just as Ned said.
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Post by min on Jul 15, 2016 15:28:38 GMT
Group pressure to conform is very powerful. Otherwise, ostracism might follow. I am not really stuck on my own ideas; I can be persuaded otherwise pretty easily with a better argument or mystery. The one thing I can't seem to let go is Jon's parentage. I'm still with Ned as Jon's sire and not just because everyone dismisses it. I'm hoping for this as well, that Ned was Jon's father after all and Wylla his mother, just as Ned said. I still have to go with Wylla as a smoke screen and Ashara as his mother. There is the question of fAegon who dies his hair blue to honor his mother. Also flying under the radar.
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Post by Melifeather on Jul 15, 2016 15:44:31 GMT
I'm hoping for this as well, that Ned was Jon's father after all and Wylla his mother, just as Ned said. I still have to go with Wylla as a smoke screen and Ashara as his mother. There is the question of fAegon who dies his hair blue to honor his mother. Also flying under the radar. How does coloring his hair blue honor his mother? Was she Tyroshi? I'm inclined to believe fAegon isn't fake, but if he is then there should be a baby swap that mirrors Gilly's son and monster.
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