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Post by min on Aug 4, 2016 9:19:00 GMT
LOL - Jojen doesn't say and neither does Martin. We're just told that one day his third eye opened after being inside Summer for three days.
Which brings me to Dany and the 3rd eye connection to darkness that Ser Duncan pointed out upthread.
aGoT - Dany
No, Dany wanted to say, no, not that, you mustn't, but when she opened her mouth, a long wail of pain escaped, and the sweat broke over her skin. What was wrong with them, couldn't they see? Inside the tent the shapes were dancing, circling, the brazier and the bloody bath, dark against the sandsilk, and some did not look human. She glimpsed the shadow of a great wolf, and another like a man wreathed in flames.
"The Lamb Woman knows the secrets of the birthing bed," Irri said. "She said so, I heard her." "Yes", Doreah agreed, "I heard her too."
No, she shouted, or perhaps she only thought it, for no whisper of sound escaped hr lips. She was being carried. Her eyes opened to gaze up at a flat dead sky, black and bleak and starless. Please, no. The sound of Mirri Maz Duur's voice grew louder, until it filled the world. The shapes! she screamed. The dancers!
Ser Jorah carried her inside the tent.
How long was Dany in a fever dream? I have to check, but was it three days? Curious that MMD is the Lamb Woman about to be sacrificed. What do dragons eat again?
I wonder how long Lyanna's fever dream lasted. And Ned's.
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Post by min on Aug 4, 2016 9:59:03 GMT
Jojen tells Bran abuot the sea coming to Winterfell and seeing drowned bodies of people he now recognizes. Bran doesn't believe him at first so he tells him about little Walder and big Walder recieving a poor cut of meat witch they relish and Bran recieves he best cut which he doesn't enjoy. Then they recieve the news that the Walder's uncle has been killed in battle and boys are delighted because that changes the succession. Then Bran realizes that Jojen is telling the truth and want to warn everyone. Jojen says it doesn't matter that green dreams are true and can't be changed. Alebelly hears the news that he will drown and refuses to bathe and go to the well. He stays behind at Winterfell instead of going with the war party towards the sea. In the end he is killed by theon's gang. So either people won't believe you or they will take action that leads to the same result. Jojen also sees Reek v1.0 peeling off Bran and Rickon's faces. This turns out to be about substituting the miller's boys instead of their death. (And makes me wonder if Reek is a faceless man.) I would see that an example on how prophecy can be used to change the future if properly used. Jojen dreams of Ramsay (I would call him Reek 2.0) flaying Rickon and Bran; he also sees Rickon and Bran in the crypts. Based on that dream Howland send his children to Winterfell where they design a plan to save Bran and Rickon without trying to change the prophecy too much: send the wolves away and hide in the crypts. Without the prophecy they would not have thought of hiding in the crypts and would have been captured by Ramsay later on. Meera does dispute that with him. Jojen knows the time and place and manner of his own death. The terrible knowledge of the third eye; the past, the future, the truth. She insists that foreknowledge should make it possible to avoid. But Jojen doesn't see a way out and insists that the dreams can't be changed. He does acknowledge that what he sees doesn't always mean what people think it means and we have the example of Alebelly. But then there is the example of Reek. Peeling the faces off Bran and Rickon doesn't necessarily mean they were meant to die; only that Theon used their identity and claimed they were dead. Jojen's arrival with that information probably saved their lives. It's the faceless man equation that death pays for life and it plays into the necessity that the world must believe the boy is dead. If Jojen didn't arrive before Ramsey took Winterfell; it's high probability that he would have killed both Stark boys. Theon only comes up with this plan when he fails to find them and doesn't want to be seen as incompetent for losing his important hostages. So Jojen just happens to recieve a greendream about it and is then sent to Winterfell to renew the pledge of allegiance to Bran directly and Bran's pledge to protect in return. It's interesting that Dany goes in search of the truth at the House of Undying and is shown visions of the past and future. Morrows not yet made suggests that foretold events can be changed. If Bran is unbound by time, he can appear to anyone in their present time; whether or not that is in his past or not. But that will already have occurred somewhere in the book as Ser Duncan points out. I can only think of one possibility and that's what happened at the ToJ. It may be the small change event that has the butterfly effect of the storm in the current story. The world is already falling into anarchy.
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Post by Melifeather on Aug 4, 2016 11:16:10 GMT
It's a theory of mine that Drogo's funeral pyre broke the wheel of time and turned it inside out, but the magic "recipe" worked because there were three blood magic rituals leading up to it: Summerhal Tower of Joy Mirri's Tent
After Drogo's funeral pyre is when events began to occur in reverse order and inverted. If east is west and north is south, did the ward at the Wall remain intact or is it too inside out? Magic is no longer contained. It's born freely upon the cold wind north of the Wall raising the dead to wights, but it's not constricted to the north. Dragons hatched. That takes a bit of magic, and the accounts of the street magicians doing truly wondrous things, and how the acolytes say their spells for working with wildfire work better...so there are accounts that magic is everywhere. The Wall is expelling and the tunnels underground are exhaust exits. But if the Wall is expelling does that necessarily mean that the white walkers and wights cannot pass? Coldhands thinks he cannot pass, but maybe just not through the Black Gate? I think once the white walkers and wights get to the Wall, they're going to crawl up the side of the Wall and go over.
Daenerys says she had "sensed the truth of it long ago", that the braziers weren't hot enough to hatch the dragons. Did Bloodraven whisper instructions in her dreams and into her subconscious? If so then the breaking of the wheel was deliberate and Bran is to over see it's dismantling. Bran the Unbuilder.
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Post by min on Aug 4, 2016 11:55:26 GMT
I think the great lore that raised the wall and protects from the killing cold fell when Drogon burned the blue heart at the center of the House of Undying. I think the ward stops the wights and Coldhands is still in place at the Black Gate and only appears when Coldhands is present. It's connected to the Hinge of the Wall. I think it's counterpart is located in the crypts of Winterfell and that door appears when direwolves are present. That might exlain why direwolves don't appear on the south side of the wall unless the old gods send them; why there are no Old Nan stories about direwolves; why all the kings of winter in the crypts have a direwolf by their side; and why direwolves initiate the warg bond. The ward at the wall is meant to point to the small but significant plot device: that direwolves initiate contact and open the door.
This might be the explanation for Hodor's fear when Ned comes to Bran and Rickon in the crypts. The door or the Winterfell Gate is open and Hodor has some previous experience with it. Possibly he went into the crypts to see Ned's brother and father after they were killed by Aerys and something came through the gate that shouldn't be there. This suggests something about Hodor's latent abilities before his mind was damaged. Perhaps the future winged wolf came to open the door to recieve their spirits and Hodor came in at the wrong time.
I think both the Black gate and the Winterfell gate are tied to their respective godswood (heart) trees. And I wonder if the Gate at Winterfell will have Bran's face.
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Post by Melifeather on Aug 4, 2016 17:02:15 GMT
I think the great lore that raised the wall and protects from the killing cold fell when Drogon burned the blue heart at the center of the House of Undying. I think the ward stops the wights and Coldhands is still in place at the Black Gate and only appears when Coldhands is present. It's connected to the Hinge of the Wall. I think it's counterpart is located in the crypts of Winterfell and that door appears when direwolves are present. That might exlain why direwolves don't appear on the south side of the wall unless the old gods send them; why there are no Old Nan stories about direwolves; why all the kings of winter in the crypts have a direwolf by their side; and why direwolves initiate the warg bond. The ward at the wall is meant to point to the small but significant plot device: that direwolves initiate contact and open the door. This might be the explanation for Hodor's fear when Ned comes to Bran and Rickon in the crypts. The door or the Winterfell Gate is open and Hodor has some previous experience with it. Possibly he went into the crypts to see Ned's brother and father after they were killed by Aerys and something came through the gate that shouldn't be there. This suggests something about Hodor's latent abilities before his mind was damaged. Perhaps the future winged wolf came to open the door to recieve their spirits and Hodor came in at the wrong time. I think both the Black gate and the Winterfell gate are tied to their respective godswood (heart) trees. And I wonder if the Gate at Winterfell will have Bran's face. Ser Duncan reminded me that whatever broke the wheel and changed the course happened after the Rebellion, but before the Starks got their direwolf pups, because white walkers and wights reappeared before Dany was in the House of the Undying.
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Post by Ser Duncan on Aug 4, 2016 17:07:14 GMT
Daenerys says she had "sensed the truth of it long ago", that the braziers weren't hot enough to hatch the dragons. Did Bloodraven whisper instructions in her dreams and into her subconscious? If so then the breaking of the wheel was deliberate and Bran is to over see it's dismantling. Bran the Unbuilder. That's an interesting take Dany knowing the braziers weren't enough. Maybe BR is trying to trigger or encourage the last dragon into action in order to balance the Ice with Fire. Now I think on it, BR's influence might have been at play with all three events, Summerhal, ToJ and Drogo's Pyre.
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Post by min on Aug 4, 2016 17:11:18 GMT
Interesting that Jojen says that the (green) wood and fire are equally strong. The wood might be a bit charred on the outside but it's green on the inside.
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Post by min on Aug 5, 2016 2:08:38 GMT
I think I've found some really good bits in DwD Bran chapters Bran I, II and III that place him in Bloodraven's cave when he appears to Jon as WierBran.
1) I'm not afraid anymore.
Bran was never afraid of the Crypts at Winterfell or the darkness. He may have been afraid of what was going on outside the crypts but his fear at that time was more about his dreams.
In DwD Bran I starts out with Bran telling himself that he is almost a grown man and he must be brave. This goes back to GoT Bran I when he asks his father if a man can be brave if he is afraid and Ned tells him; it's the only time a man can be brave. It's an admission to himself that he is afraid. He goes on to say that the whole party is more afraid than they ever were on the south side of the wall. By the time they arrive at the Greenseers Cave; they are week, starving and hypothermic. Coldhands and Summer both sense the presence of the wights under the snow and this is another time that Hodor shows fear. Coldhands asks them if they can smell the cold and if they can they see anything. Then they are attacked and losing ground when Hodor begins to whimper and suddenly Bran finds himself inside Hodor in a beserker mode. This is the point where Bran conquers his fear.
DwD Bran II
"Hoooodor" came a whimper, from somewhere down below.
And suddenly he was not Bran, the broken boy crawling through the snow, suddenly he was Hodor halfway down the hill, with the wight raking at his eyes. Roaring, he came lurching to his feet, throwing the thing violently aside. It went to one knee, began to rise again. Bran ripped Hodor's longsword from his belt. Deep inside he could hear poor Hodor whimpering still, but outside he was seven feet of fury with old iron in his hand. He raised the sword and brought it down upon the dead man, grunting as the blade sheared through wet wool and rusted mail and rotted leather, biting deep into the bones and flesh beneath. "HODOR" he bellowed, and slashed again. This time he took the wight's head off at the neck, and for half a moment he exulted ... until a pair of dead hands came groping blindly for his throat.
Bran backed away bleeding, and Meera Reed was there, driving her frog spear deep into the wight's back "Hodor," Bran roared again, waving her uphill. "Hodor, hodor." Jojen was twisting feebly where she'd laid him down, Bran went to him, dropped the longsword, gathered the boy into Hodor's arm, and lurched back to his feet. "HODOR", he bellowed.
Meera led the way back up the hill, jabbing at the wights when they came near. The things could not be hurt, but they were slow and clumsy. "Hodor", Hodor said with every step. "Hodor, hodor," He wondered what Meera would think if he should suddenly tell her that he loved her.
And then Leaf comes to their aid with fire.
2) I like it here - aDwD Bran III
Bran is quite comfortable with food and fire; his bed of moss and furs; and that he is not the crippled boy anymore. He can come and go in Summer as he pleases and sometimes as Hodor. He is learning to use the Ravens and sometimes he just watches from above (using the moon's eye view). He exults in this ability and wishes that he could show Rob that he could fly and thinks that his brothers and sisters could fly as well.
'Do all the birds have singers in them?"
"All," Lord Brynden said. "It was the singers who taught the First Men to send messages by raven ... but in those days, the birds would speak the words. The trees remember, but men forget, and so now they write the messages on parchment and tie them round the feet of birds who have never shared their skin."
Old Nan had told him the same story once, Bran remembered, but when he asked Robb if it was true, his brother laughed and asked him if he believed in grumkins too. He wished Robb were with them now. I'd tell him I could fly, but he wouldn't believe me, so I'd have to show him. I bet that he could learn to fly too, him and Arya and Sansa, even baby Rickon and Jon Snow. We could all be ravens and live in Maester Luwin's rookery.
That was just another silly dream, though. Some days Bran wondered if all of this wasn't just some dream. Maybe he had fallen asleep out in the snows and dreamed himself a safe place. You have to wake, he would tell himself, you have to wake right now, or you'll go dreaming into death. Once or twice he pinched his arm with his fingers, really hard, but the only thing that did was make his arm hurt. In the beginning he had tried to count the days by making note of when he woke and slept, but down here sleeping and waking had a way of melting into one another. Dreams became lessons, lessons became dreams, things happened all at once or not at all. Had he done that or only dreamed it?
So Bran takes the notion that he can teach his brothers and sisters how to fly but I still don't think this has happened yet. I think in order for Bran to appear as WierBran he has to assume the identity of the tree and that hasn't occurred yet. Or it may be that he is on the cusp of these abilities since what follows is that he takes the paste.
3) They can't see you, but you can see them is pretty obvious I think. Since the next thing that happens to Jon is the that he sees whe wiildling encampment from above.
4) The smell of death: aGoT - Jon VII
This is a sensory perception that Ghost-Jon experiences; something that they have already experienced and recognize. The wights are still shambling about the entrance to BR's cave and the smell of the cold, the wretched stench of the wights and the smell of death was first encountered in aGoT when Jon and Ghost fight with Othor.
Jon had no time to be afraid. He threw himself forward, shouting, bringing down the longsword with all his weight behind it. Steel sheared through sleeve and skin and bone, yet the sound was wrong somehow. The smell that engulfed him was so queer and cold he almost gagged. He saw arm an hand on the floor, black fingers wriggling in a pool of moonlight. Ghost wrenched free of the other hand a crept away, red tongue lolling from his mouth.
The hooded man lifted his pale moon face, and Jon slashed at it without hesitation. The sword laid the intruder open to the bone, taking off half his nose and opening a gash cheek to cheek under those eyes, eyes, eyes like blue stars burning. Jon knew that face. Othor, he thought, reeling back. Gods, he's dead, he's dead. I saw him dead.
I think this enough to say that the WierBran connection didn't originate from the Crypts of Winterfell but in BR's Cave and that Bran did reach out to Jon in his past and open his third eye.
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Post by Melifeather on Aug 5, 2016 10:45:46 GMT
Maybe the reversal of the wheel was a two-fold process? Something was done to release magic first making it possible for Drogo's funeral pyre to break the wheel? The wiki has white walkers appearing in 298 and dragons in 299. I'm searching my brain trying to think what could have been done, but the only thing that comes to mind would be for Mance to have done something. How long has he been uniting the wildling tribes? And how long has Craster been sacrificing his sons?
Some Pig has a theory that Rhaegar was resurrected at the tower of joy and is now disguised as Mance. The Targaryens know something about the wheel and maybe Mance Rhaegar is working with the Children and Bloodraven to use the white walkers as weapons again?
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Post by Weasel Pie on Aug 5, 2016 12:00:09 GMT
Her eyes opened to gaze up at a flat dead sky, black and bleak and starless Dany has unquestionable wargish/third eye powers, thanks for including that in this thread, because I believe it's proof that Dany might be the RL baby. Her relationship with her Silver is akin to the Starks relationships with their direwolves. And of course the horse being the connection to Lyanna. Similar to above is, of course, the similarity between Bran eating weirwood paste and Dany drinking shade of the evening - both events serve to open their third eyes even further. If Bran is unbound by time, he can appear to anyone in their present time; whether or not that is in his past or not. But that will already have occurred somewhere in the book as Ser Duncan points out. I can only think of one possibility and that's what happened at the ToJ. It may be the small change event that has the butterfly effect of the storm in the current story. The world is already falling into anarchy. Well stated min. I know these things get tricky to explain but I'll try. I think future Bran has already made all the changes to the past, and those can't be unchanged. An example would be Hodor. Bran can't go back and prevent Hodor from being Hodored - because Hodor needs to be Hodor. After Drogo's funeral pyre is when events began to occur in reverse order and inverted. If east is west and north is south, did the ward at the Wall remain intact or is it too inside out? Magic is no longer contained. It's born freely upon the cold wind north of the Wall raising the dead to wights, but it's not constricted to the north. Dragons hatched. That takes a bit of magic, and the accounts of the street magicians doing truly wondrous things, and how the acolytes say their spells for working with wildfire work better...so there are accounts that magic is everywhere. The Wall is expelling and the tunnels underground are exhaust exits. But if the Wall is expelling does that necessarily mean that the white walkers and wights cannot pass? Coldhands thinks he cannot pass, but maybe just not through the Black Gate? I think once the white walkers and wights get to the Wall, they're going to crawl up the side of the Wall and go over. Daenerys says she had "sensed the truth of it long ago", that the braziers weren't hot enough to hatch the dragons. Did Bloodraven whisper instructions in her dreams and into her subconscious? If so then the breaking of the wheel was deliberate and Bran is to over see it's dismantling. Bran the Unbuilder. I almost get this. How is that moment in time (Drogo's pyre) proven to be when the transmission gets put in reverse? I'm not sure it's exactly then though I can follow your train of thought. And of course I love the idea of the tunnels being exhaust ports
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Post by Weasel Pie on Aug 5, 2016 12:05:32 GMT
I think the great lore that raised the wall and protects from the killing cold fell when Drogon burned the blue heart at the center of the House of Undying. I think the ward stops the wights and Coldhands is still in place at the Black Gate and only appears when Coldhands is present. It's connected to the Hinge of the Wall. I think it's counterpart is located in the crypts of Winterfell and that door appears when direwolves are present. That might exlain why direwolves don't appear on the south side of the wall unless the old gods send them; why there are no Old Nan stories about direwolves; why all the kings of winter in the crypts have a direwolf by their side; and why direwolves initiate the warg bond. The ward at the wall is meant to point to the small but significant plot device: that direwolves initiate contact and open the door. This might be the explanation for Hodor's fear when Ned comes to Bran and Rickon in the crypts. The door or the Winterfell Gate is open and Hodor has some previous experience with it. Possibly he went into the crypts to see Ned's brother and father after they were killed by Aerys and something came through the gate that shouldn't be there. This suggests something about Hodor's latent abilities before his mind was damaged. Perhaps the future winged wolf came to open the door to recieve their spirits and Hodor came in at the wrong time. I think both the Black gate and the Winterfell gate are tied to their respective godswood (heart) trees. And I wonder if the Gate at Winterfell will have Bran's face. I also think the burning of the blue heart is significant! And I agree 100% that Hodor experienced something in the crypts, and that there is a gate in the crypts. The swords on the laps of the stone kings are denial of guest right, and I'll argue that all day.
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Post by min on Aug 5, 2016 13:32:50 GMT
Thanks Weasel Pie and Melifeather. I'm not as fast on my feet as the two of you and Some Pig. I generally have to stick with one line or reasoning at a time. But I think I have addressed the sticking points over at Westeros.
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Post by Weasel Pie on Aug 5, 2016 13:47:28 GMT
Thanks Weasel Pie and Melifeather. I'm not as fast on my feet as the two of you and Some Pig. I generally have to stick with one line or reasoning at a time. But I think I have addressed the sticking points over at Westeros. I'm on page 14 of 189 over there so... still reading lol. But can't wait to get to your newest info. And stahp it, don't sell yourself so short because this is great stuff, it goes above and beyond.
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Post by min on Aug 5, 2016 13:52:59 GMT
Thanks Weasel Pie and Melifeather. I'm not as fast on my feet as the two of you and Some Pig. I generally have to stick with one line or reasoning at a time. But I think I have addressed the sticking points over at Westeros. I'm on page 14 of 189 over there so... still reading lol. But can't wait to get to your newest info. And stahp it, don't sell yourself so short because this is great stuff, it goes above and beyond. It's all copied here including the points addressing the sticking point.
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tucu
Black Iron
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Post by tucu on Aug 5, 2016 14:22:19 GMT
I think I've found some really good bits in DwD Bran chapters Bran I, II and III that place him in Bloodraven's cave when he appears to Jon as WierBran. 1) I'm not afraid anymore. Bran was never afraid of the Crypts at Winterfell or the darkness. He may have been afraid of what was going on outside the crypts but his fear at that time was more about his dreams. In DwD Bran I starts out with Bran telling himself that he is almost a grown man and he must be brave. This goes back to GoT Bran I when he asks his father if a man can be brave if he is afraid and Ned tells him; it's the only time a man can be brave. It's an admission to himself that he is afraid. He goes on to say that the whole party is more afraid than they ever were on the south side of the wall. By the time they arrive at the Greenseers Cave; they are week, starving and hypothermic. Coldhands and Summer both sense the presence of the wights under the snow and this is another time that Hodor shows fear. Coldhands asks them if they can smell the cold and if they can they see anything. Then they are attacked and losing ground when Hodor begins to whimper and suddenly Bran finds himself inside Hodor in a beserker mode. This is the point where Bran conquers his fear. DwD Bran II "Hoooodor" came a whimper, from somewhere down below.
And suddenly he was not Bran, the broken boy crawling through the snow, suddenly he was Hodor halfway down the hill, with the wight raking at his eyes. Roaring, he came lurching to his feet, throwing the thing violently aside. It went to one knee, began to rise again. Bran ripped Hodor's longsword from his belt. Deep inside he could hear poor Hodor whimpering still, but outside he was seven feet of fury with old iron in his hand. He raised the sword and brought it down upon the dead man, grunting as the blade sheared through wet wool and rusted mail and rotted leather, biting deep into the bones and flesh beneath. "HODOR" he bellowed, and slashed again. This time he took the wight's head off at the neck, and for half a moment he exulted ... until a pair of dead hands came groping blindly for his throat.
Bran backed away bleeding, and Meera Reed was there, driving her frog spear deep into the wight's back "Hodor," Bran roared again, waving her uphill. "Hodor, hodor." Jojen was twisting feebly where she'd laid him down, Bran went to him, dropped the longsword, gathered the boy into Hodor's arm, and lurched back to his feet. "HODOR", he bellowed.
Meera led the way back up the hill, jabbing at the wights when they came near. The things could not be hurt, but they were slow and clumsy. "Hodor", Hodor said with every step. "Hodor, hodor," He wondered what Meera would think if he should suddenly tell her that he loved her.And then Leaf comes to their aid with fire. 2) I like it here - aDwD Bran III Bran is quite comfortable with food and fire; his bed of moss and furs; and that he is not the crippled boy anymore. He can come and go in Summer as he pleases and sometimes as Hodor. He is learning to use the Ravens and sometimes he just watches from above (using the moon's eye view). He exults in this ability and wishes that he could show Rob that he could fly and thinks that his brothers and sisters could fly as well. 'Do all the birds have singers in them?"
"All," Lord Brynden said. "It was the singers who taught the First Men to send messages by raven ... but in those days, the birds would speak the words. The trees remember, but men forget, and so now they write the messages on parchment and tie them round the feet of birds who have never shared their skin."
Old Nan had told him the same story once, Bran remembered, but when he asked Robb if it was true, his brother laughed and asked him if he believed in grumkins too. He wished Robb were with them now. I'd tell him I could fly, but he wouldn't believe me, so I'd have to show him. I bet that he could learn to fly too, him and Arya and Sansa, even baby Rickon and Jon Snow. We could all be ravens and live in Maester Luwin's rookery.
That was just another silly dream, though. Some days Bran wondered if all of this wasn't just some dream. Maybe he had fallen asleep out in the snows and dreamed himself a safe place. You have to wake, he would tell himself, you have to wake right now, or you'll go dreaming into death. Once or twice he pinched his arm with his fingers, really hard, but the only thing that did was make his arm hurt. In the beginning he had tried to count the days by making note of when he woke and slept, but down here sleeping and waking had a way of melting into one another. Dreams became lessons, lessons became dreams, things happened all at once or not at all. Had he done that or only dreamed it?
So Bran takes the notion that he can teach his brothers and sisters how to fly but I still don't think this has happened yet. I think in order for Bran to appear as WierBran he has to assume the identity of the tree and that hasn't occurred yet. Or it may be that he is on the cusp of these abilities since what follows is that he takes the paste.
3) They can't see you, but you can see them is pretty obvious I think. Since the next thing that happens to Jon is the that he sees whe wiildling encampment from above.
4) The smell of death: aGoT - Jon VII
This is a sensory perception that Ghost-Jon experiences; something that they have already experienced and recognize. The wights are still shambling about the entrance to BR's cave and the smell of the cold, the wretched stench of the wights and the smell of death was first encountered in aGoT when Jon and Ghost fight with Othor.
Jon had no time to be afraid. He threw himself forward, shouting, bringing down the longsword with all his weight behind it. Steel sheared through sleeve and skin and bone, yet the sound was wrong somehow. The smell that engulfed him was so queer and cold he almost gagged. He saw arm an hand on the floor, black fingers wriggling in a pool of moonlight. Ghost wrenched free of the other hand a crept away, red tongue lolling from his mouth.
The hooded man lifted his pale moon face, and Jon slashed at it without hesitation. The sword laid the intruder open to the bone, taking off half his nose and opening a gash cheek to cheek under those eyes, eyes, eyes like blue stars burning. Jon knew that face. Othor, he thought, reeling back. Gods, he's dead, he's dead. I saw him dead.
I think this enough to say that the WierBran connection didn't originate from the Crypts of Winterfell but in BR's Cave and that Bran did reach out to Jon in his past and open his third eye.
I think the ambiguity is still clearly there. Going point by point: 1) Tree-Bran never tells Jon that he used to be afraid(of the dark, the crypt or the cave). Tree-Bran said: "Don't be afraid" 2) Bran says: "I like it in the dark. No one can see you, but you can see them". This describes the crypts very well. Theon and Ramsay's men can't see them there, but he can see them through Summer 3) Same as number 2) 4) It is a crypt full of bones of old Starks
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