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Post by min on Aug 27, 2016 10:54:03 GMT
And some of them are likely to reject even that. Likely? Try definitely. Remember all the comments about how should GRRM dare to produce anything other than RLJ at the end, such would only make him a hack writer that abandoned his principles/succumbed to the need of shock value/phoned it in, because obviously there is no other alternative to the conclusion that fans figured out years ago. So in other words, they had a tantrum and told GRRM what he had to write or else; just to satisfy a few hardcore RLJ survivalists. OK, I'm amused again. The thing is that I've conversed with many very decent people who subscribe to RLJ. Some of them are independent thinkers who take their own flack over ideas. I don't take issue with what people want to make out of GRRM's Rorschach inkblot or prime number rat maze, if you prefer. Obnoxious attitude and commentary should be consigned to the trash bin where it belongs.
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Post by jnr on Aug 27, 2016 14:06:40 GMT
Remember all the comments about how should GRRM dare to produce anything other than RLJ at the end, such would only make him a hack writer that abandoned his principles/succumbed to the need of shock value/phoned it in, because obviously there is no other alternative to the conclusion that fans figured out years ago. Oh, I remember. I'll be reminding them of such remarks in due course. I just wonder if all the people who said such things will really maintain logical consistency at that point, given the irrefutable evidence -- which may well include confirmation from GRRM in interviews! -- that they as a group have been wildly wrong for nearly twenty years. GRRM's motive to confirm this will be very strong, because he'll be wanting to crow about the stunt he pulled off, which is admittedly an incredible one. It's the cliche and bigotry of the ' reservation' remarks that irks me, ' if you know what I mean'. I do indeed. And congrats on correct usage of bigotry -- "intolerance of other people's opinions" -- given the way that word has come to mean a wildly different thing these days.
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Post by wolfmaid7 on Aug 27, 2016 15:31:41 GMT
Which brings Varys to mind. He keeps saying that he is doing what he is doing for the realm; for the children. Given that he doesn't hesitate to use children in the most onerous manner; acquiring them through the slave trade and cutting out their tongues; I have to wonder what he's talking about. What does he do with them when they are too old or too big to run around the ratways behind the walls? That is a rather uncomfortable thought. I just wonder if all the people who said such things will really maintain logical consistency at that point, given the irrefutable evidence -- which may well include confirmation from GRRM in interviews! -- that they as a group have been wildly wrong for nearly twenty years. GRRM's motive to confirm this will be very strong, because he'll be wanting to crow about the stunt he pulled off, which is admittedly an incredible one. Do you remember "the dress?" The one that was white and gold and some people saw blue and white. Well the dress is the clue to Jon's parentage and we are arguing about the clues and the validity of them essentially.
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Post by ac on Aug 27, 2016 17:26:39 GMT
I had a long detailed theory on this that I posted w/r/t Tyrion as a Targaryen; I'll have to find it. I think it is definitely feasible that Tyrion is Aerys' bastard with Joanna. My biggest concern about that is why Tywin would raise him as his own, especially following Joanna's death. However, from what we know about her she is basically the only person that Tywin truly loved and so it is feasible he would try to protect her honour / keep her away from Aerys. I'd love to read the post. I'd also be interested to hear what you have in mind re "Where whores go".
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Post by ac on Aug 27, 2016 17:28:17 GMT
Do you remember "the dress?" The one that was white and gold and some people saw blue and white. Well the dress is the clue to Jon's parentage and we are arguing about the clues and the validity of them essentially. Do you mean the white is Lyanna and the gold/blue is Aerys/Rhaegar?
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Post by min on Aug 27, 2016 17:40:24 GMT
Read something on W that tickled my fancy. Dan Aerys. LOL! Is that really so farfetched?
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Post by wolfmaid7 on Aug 27, 2016 21:05:03 GMT
Do you remember "the dress?" The one that was white and gold and some people saw blue and white. Well the dress is the clue to Jon's parentage and we are arguing about the clues and the validity of them essentially. Do you mean the white is Lyanna and the gold/blue is Aerys/Rhaegar? Ha nahhhh.I've been off the Targwagon for a while.I'm sticking with the kingdom's grand bastard maker.
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Post by ac on Aug 28, 2016 2:16:47 GMT
I think this is an important clue, and if you've read King Monkeys thread about the tower of joy echoes, the sacrificing of children is one of the repeated elements. KM focuses on giving birth to dragons and he's missing or passing over the parts about sacricing children. Which brings Varys to mind. He keeps saying that he is doing what he is doing for the realm; for the children. Given that he doesn't hesitate to use children in the most onerous manner; acquiring them through the slave trade and cutting out their tongues; I have to wonder what he's talking about. What does he do with them when they are too old or too big to run around the ratways behind the walls? Is Varys the well known Aerys supporter doing it for his 3 (bastard) children already mentioned in this thread ?
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Post by ac on Aug 28, 2016 2:19:50 GMT
Do you mean the white is Lyanna and the gold/blue is Aerys/Rhaegar? Ha nahhhh.I've been off the Targwagon for a while.I'm sticking with the kingdom's grand bastard maker. Robert? Interesting. Although not sure how Ned would be OK with that. Have you written anything about this?
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Post by Melifeather on Aug 28, 2016 2:33:38 GMT
Ha nahhhh.I've been off the Targwagon for a while.I'm sticking with the kingdom's grand bastard maker. Robert? Interesting. Although not sure how Ned would be OK with that. Have you written anything about this? Heh. 😜
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Post by wolfmaid7 on Aug 28, 2016 5:26:52 GMT
Ha nahhhh.I've been off the Targwagon for a while.I'm sticking with the kingdom's grand bastard maker. Robert? Interesting. Although not sure how Ned would be OK with that. Have you written anything about this? He couldn't do anything once the deed was done and bethrothed Lyanna to a dude who had his first kid before he was 18.What do they think was gonna happen!!
Robert +Lyanna=Jon
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Post by Ser Duncan on Aug 28, 2016 19:07:09 GMT
Sorry, still catching myself up on this thread... My feeling is that, whatever the reason he is there, it is based on info from Ethan Glover. Maybe something revealed by Aerys when they arrived with Brandon to confront Rhaegar. Me too. Been saying and thinking this for a while now. Strange that he should be the sole survivor of all the (200?) men that went to KL, and that he just happened to be Brandon's squire. I would imagine he at least was present during Brandon and Rickard's final moments. He and Jaime must know more. Since Jaime is the only one with a voice in the series, I would think we will get more from him at some point. I wonder if we'll ever get a reason for Ethan's miraculous survival. Yep, this is suspicious to me as well. He lives through that hell and conveniently dies at the ToJ so that we don't any more details from him. And what children were killed prior to the Rebellion? Excellent question. I'd like an answer to that too, but I doubt we'll get it. What does he do with them when they are too old or too big to run around the ratways behind the walls? Another excellent question. My guess would be they are either killed or sent back across the Narrow Sea to live like urchins. Much like we see Arya doing in Braavos. If they survive, some of them would make good scribes to the Sealord or the other magnates of the Free Cities. Or Faceless Men
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Post by ac on Aug 28, 2016 20:31:36 GMT
My feeling is that, whatever the reason he is there, it is based on info from Ethan Glover. Maybe something revealed by Aerys when they arrived with Brandon to confront Rhaegar. Me too. Been saying and thinking this for a while now. Strange that he should be the sole survivor of all the (200?) men that went to KL, and that he just happened to be Brandon's squire. I would imagine he at least was present during Brandon and Rickard's final moments. He and Jaime must know more. Since Jaime is the only one with a voice in the series, I would think we will get more from him at some point. My guess was that, at least for Brandon's companions and their fathers, Aerys had kept them as prisoners and every so often was burning one of them for his entertainment. Ethan, maybe because he was the youngest, was just the last one left. Yeah, I think Jaime will have a huge amount more to tell us. What he reveals may even finally lead to him getting the thanks / respect he feels he deserves for ridding the kingdom of Aerys. I wonder if we'll ever get a reason for Ethan's miraculous survival. Yep, this is suspicious to me as well. He lives through that hell and conveniently dies at the ToJ so that we don't any more details from him. I don't necessarily think it matters that Ethan in particular survived but I think it was important for the later reveal that someone from Brandon's group survived to pass on the information to Ned.
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Post by Maester Flagons on Aug 28, 2016 23:57:26 GMT
And what children were killed prior to the Rebellion? I was thinking it could be some of the northern crowd that were put to death with Rickard and Brandon? Although the North isn't really into knighthood and squires. Then there is the retcon of Aery's other children and all his mistresses which some of us have assumed could/should have led to bastards. Bastards used for crazy Targ rituals. Then there is Lyanna.
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Post by Maester Flagons on Aug 29, 2016 0:02:57 GMT
A thought on Ethan - His survival could parallel Dontos' own sole survival of the mass killing by Aerys. It could be that someone asked for Ethan to be spared. Maybe one of the Kingsguard even. ? Another idea is Aerys left him alive to give a firsthand report of the deaths of the other northerners.
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