|
Post by Ser Duncan on May 13, 2016 14:42:48 GMT
I was thinking the same - it's a version of 'bloody', a swear of sorts. It's kind of an anti swear. Kids (and those wanting to speak to older, uptight ladies) will get told off for saying 'bloody', which is why we use 'blasted' or 'blooming' instead. Poxy can have that kind of connotation too, but will probably not cause your mum to take a swipe at your head for saying it. So you two think the inversion of Arys drawing spots on Myrcella's handmaiden Rosamund is just a cuss word, basically calling her a bitch? No, I think you're right on the inversion because spots on a person can indicate a pox of sorts. Typhus presents with spots on the chest and can spread up the neck to the lower face, and that was considered a pox before antibiotics. Not to even mention Smallpox. Additionally, in modern jargon, we still say 'so-and-so's got the pox', and it means s/he's got a bad cold. I was thinking about how Merritt Frey called Wenda the White Fawn a "poxy bitch". The use of the word poxy here is definitely a curse and naught to do with pox. He's calling her a dirty whore for having branded his arse. I mean Wenda may have had the pox too, but the phrase in connection to someone whose wronged you is not usually a literal one.
|
|
|
Post by Melifeather on May 13, 2016 14:58:57 GMT
I was thinking the same - it's a version of 'bloody', a swear of sorts. It's kind of an anti swear. Kids (and those wanting to speak to older, uptight ladies) will get told off for saying 'bloody', which is why we use 'blasted' or 'blooming' instead. Poxy can have that kind of connotation too, but will probably not cause your mum to take a swipe at your head for saying it. So you two think the inversion of Arys drawing spots on Myrcella's handmaiden Rosamund is just a cuss word, basically calling her a bitch? No, I think you're right on the inversion because spots on a person can indicate a pox of sorts. Typhus presents with spots on the chest and can spread up the neck to the lower face, and that was considered a pox before antibiotics. Not to even mention Smallpox. Additionally, in modern jargon, we still say 'so-and-so's got the pox', and it means s/he's got a bad cold. I was thinking about how Merritt Frey called Wenda the White Fawn a "poxy bitch". The use of the word poxy here is definitely a curse and naught to do with pox. He's calling her a dirty whore for having branded his arse. I mean Wenda may have had the pox too, but the phrase in connection to someone whose wronged you is not usually a literal one. I think we're on the same page then! What I found interesting about the variation of smallpox was the bleeding under the skin and the resulting appearance as being "black", and the many references to "black blood" in the story. And consider this passage: Were the rose petals black, or was her palm black? Were they actual rose petals, or was there blood dripping from her hand? I can certainly imagine how blood spray could appear like petals flying in the wind. I'm throwing out possible scenarios...Myrcella was cut with Darkstar's sword. He cut her ear off and the blade also went down the side of her face. She survived the attack, so was Lyanna's attack a mortal injury?
|
|
|
Post by min on May 13, 2016 15:54:35 GMT
Just a random thought; the mountain's blood was black as well. Was Lyanna poisoned? the long farewell
|
|
|
Post by Melifeather on May 13, 2016 16:15:29 GMT
Just a random thought; the mountain's blood was black as well. Was Lyanna poisoned? the long farewellNot to dismiss the thought, but in away Lyanna's marriage contract with Robert was poisoned...at least that is what both The Soiled Knight and The Queenmaker chapters suggest. Cersei got her claws into Robert and seduced him, not only with her body, but the tantalizing prospect of becoming king. To do that he would need Tywin's support and to gain that all he had to do was agree to a different match, but first they needed to be rid of the first one. Simply breaking off the contract wouldn't do, because that would risk losing the Starks as allies. No, they needed to cement the Starks as allies, and what better way if their darling daughter went missing and then found dead?
|
|
|
Post by Ser Duncan on May 13, 2016 16:17:38 GMT
spilling from her palm, dead and black. so was Lyanna's attack a mortal injury? Ok let's get a bit technical here. I'm taking the 'dead and black' to be her palm, not the rose pedals, because rose pedals don't go black *usually* when squished. Black or dark blue hands, however, are as sign of cyanosis. They occurs both in injury and poisoning. All it really signifies is that the heart is no longer pumping effectively and the limbs become dark due to not having any oxygen in them. The little blood that is pumped into the limbs is also black, because they've not gotten filtered by the lungs properly. So dead, black, sluggish blood is an entirely known thing to happen to folks on their death beds, regardless of the cause.
|
|
|
Post by Some Pig No Doubt on May 13, 2016 16:21:25 GMT
Just a random thought; the mountain's blood was black as well. Was Lyanna poisoned? Possible, but if you go upthread, you'll see that Drogo's festering wound was also oozing thick black blood. Could be poison (she is in Dorne, after all), or could be simply gangrenous. Either way, I think the chances are good that she died of a wound: whether a childbirth wound or a poisoned Dornish spear wound or a good slashing wound to the gut aka King Bob - or a combination of all three, who knows - the fever and the smell of blood and sweet roses make me lean toward a slow painful death from injury.
|
|
|
Post by Some Pig No Doubt on May 13, 2016 16:26:51 GMT
It's kind of an anti swear. Kids (and those wanting to speak to older, uptight ladies) will get told off for saying 'bloody', which is why we use 'blasted' or 'blooming' instead. Poxy can have that kind of connotation too, but will probably not cause your mum to take a swipe at your head for saying it. As an American with a totally different cultural standard, I find this so funny. Use of the word 'bloody' just seems so innocuous and unoffensive, yet I know it would be the near-equivalent of using the word 'fucking' to describe something. Were I to say, "I can't open this bloody jar!" no one in the US would bat an eye, but if I said, "I can't open this fucking jar!" I would get all kinds of looks or reprimands, depending on audience/situation. So funny. Also funny that I can tell the boys, "I am going to smack your fanny if you don't get upstairs NOW" and it means one thing, but in the UK the eyebrows would totally go up at that word. /digression
|
|
|
Post by Ser Duncan on May 13, 2016 16:55:59 GMT
Also funny that I can tell the boys, "I am going to smack your fanny if you don't get upstairs NOW" and it means one thing, but in the UK the eyebrows would totally go up at that word. You got a similar reaction from me while reading that sentence! The juxtaposition of 'boys' and 'fanny' made me go What is she trying to tell us!? I can give you the origins of the use of bloody (a term my dyed in the wool NYer of a father in law used too, though he never swore, well not unless he smacked himself a good one with the hammer -- and that's allowed ), but it's kinda boring and not for this thread. Or maybe it is, if you know where the term comes from and it's connotations. Hmm.
|
|
|
Post by Melifeather on May 13, 2016 17:02:52 GMT
Even worse when you consider that "fanny" has also served as a first name....
|
|
|
Post by Ser Duncan on May 13, 2016 17:24:55 GMT
As in the phrase 'Sweet Fanny Adams'! ETA she was an actual person too, with a horrible story to her name.
|
|
|
Post by Melifeather on May 13, 2016 17:25:31 GMT
meow.
|
|
|
Post by Weasel Pie on May 17, 2016 15:18:46 GMT
A sort of inversion occurred to me.
What if "When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east" means "when time runs backwards"?
|
|
|
Post by min on May 17, 2016 16:05:46 GMT
A sort of inversion occurred to me. What if "When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east" means "when time runs backwards"? Wow! I like that.
|
|
|
Post by Melifeather on May 17, 2016 22:36:02 GMT
A sort of inversion occurred to me. What if "When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east" means "when time runs backwards"? This is evidence that the hinge is open. The Lannisters are physically in the west, they rose to power, but now their day is done and they will be extinguished. Their place on the wheel...their destiny, has been replaced by the Martells.
|
|
|
Post by Weasel Pie on Oct 2, 2017 17:43:04 GMT
Necro, I want to revisit this thread since I seem to have just mentioned some of the thoughts in the OP in another thread... the tent ritual being the mirror of what happened in the ToJ which was a blood ritual chamber, not a honeymoon hideout/birthing room.
|
|